The vast Majority of Russians DO support the invasion, which was done to stop the Donbass genocide that has ZERO chance of being recognized any time soon in the west. Or, at least, that's why the Russian PEOPLE support it.
True, but to be honest, the Ukrainians being Nazis means that Russia could have just invaded to get Target Practice and I'd still support them over Ukraine.
You want the innocent to die along with the guilty, then, since there's no way to attack Ukraine without killing innocents. That's exactly the same as saying "I want the US to keep bombing the Middle East because I don't like ISIS."
No, actually, I think the innocent may ironically be SAFER with the war going on.
Think about it, pre-war, they were subject to Nazi pogroms, now, they have an opportunity to flee as refugees. I get that it's not our first instinct to think of innocent people being SAFER when their country gets attacked, but reality IS nuanced and complex. I imagine, for instance, the Roma people are safer in places like Sweden and the UK than they EVER were in Ukraine.
This isn't like Syria or Iraq where there's a dictator, but you'll be fine if you don't break the law. Ukraine has been guilty for decades, if not centuries of Pogroms and genocides, Even before the Nazis came along, there was still Ethno Nationalism in Western Ukraine.
I don't care about the numbers. I will never support bombing any country to "save" people who might have been safe if you hadn't bombed. And what was stopping any of them from fleeing earlier if things were as bad as that? People have fled countries that weren't under external attack before.
You take action that kills civilians, you're no good. Period. They said that nuking Hiroshima meant a lot of Japanese lives that would've been lost in conventional warfare were saved. It doesn't matter if that's true; nuking Hiroshima was wrong, because it killed civilians. Period.
I didn't say Russia should have bombed them TO save the innocent people, I said that those people arguably MIGHT be better off when the government has to divert resources towards the war and AWAY from keeping them in to like, pogrom and genocide them. There's also the issue that citizenship in another country isn't as easy as applying for one, and that refugee/asylum status makes it easier.
And I wouldn't have pointed THAT out had you not brought up innocent people in the first place. It wasn't even the point I was making.
The point I was making is that with just about all separatists out of Ukraine at this point, and most minorities having been genocided or pogromed out of existence, it's mostly just the Nazis left over anyway. But yes, no innocents should die, the point I was making wasn't that this war was saving them, but that it isn't doing that much, if anything, to doom them. Or at least, nothing more than their own Nazi government and Nazi neighbors were in the first place.
Check my latest substack...
The vast Majority of Russians DO support the invasion, which was done to stop the Donbass genocide that has ZERO chance of being recognized any time soon in the west. Or, at least, that's why the Russian PEOPLE support it.
But they didn't make it happen. I said that they weren't complicit, and if they merely support it then they still aren't complicit.
True, but to be honest, the Ukrainians being Nazis means that Russia could have just invaded to get Target Practice and I'd still support them over Ukraine.
Bit extreme I know, but I don't like Nazis.
You want the innocent to die along with the guilty, then, since there's no way to attack Ukraine without killing innocents. That's exactly the same as saying "I want the US to keep bombing the Middle East because I don't like ISIS."
No, actually, I think the innocent may ironically be SAFER with the war going on.
Think about it, pre-war, they were subject to Nazi pogroms, now, they have an opportunity to flee as refugees. I get that it's not our first instinct to think of innocent people being SAFER when their country gets attacked, but reality IS nuanced and complex. I imagine, for instance, the Roma people are safer in places like Sweden and the UK than they EVER were in Ukraine.
This isn't like Syria or Iraq where there's a dictator, but you'll be fine if you don't break the law. Ukraine has been guilty for decades, if not centuries of Pogroms and genocides, Even before the Nazis came along, there was still Ethno Nationalism in Western Ukraine.
I don't care about the numbers. I will never support bombing any country to "save" people who might have been safe if you hadn't bombed. And what was stopping any of them from fleeing earlier if things were as bad as that? People have fled countries that weren't under external attack before.
You take action that kills civilians, you're no good. Period. They said that nuking Hiroshima meant a lot of Japanese lives that would've been lost in conventional warfare were saved. It doesn't matter if that's true; nuking Hiroshima was wrong, because it killed civilians. Period.
I didn't say Russia should have bombed them TO save the innocent people, I said that those people arguably MIGHT be better off when the government has to divert resources towards the war and AWAY from keeping them in to like, pogrom and genocide them. There's also the issue that citizenship in another country isn't as easy as applying for one, and that refugee/asylum status makes it easier.
And I wouldn't have pointed THAT out had you not brought up innocent people in the first place. It wasn't even the point I was making.
The point I was making is that with just about all separatists out of Ukraine at this point, and most minorities having been genocided or pogromed out of existence, it's mostly just the Nazis left over anyway. But yes, no innocents should die, the point I was making wasn't that this war was saving them, but that it isn't doing that much, if anything, to doom them. Or at least, nothing more than their own Nazi government and Nazi neighbors were in the first place.